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Last time NCSU had 7 TOP 12 teams at one time in a given season

Womens Bball #1/2 depends on poll

Womens Swim #4

Womens Tennis #12

Mens Swim #6

Mens Tennis #12

Mens Wrestling #3

Co-ed Rifle #11

honorable mention Baseball preseason #17

Too bad it not mens BB.


  • ryebreadryebread Posts: 2,675PFN Referee

    It's incredibly awesome and a testament to the fact that programs CAN win at NC State. The problem is that unless it is men's basketball or football, most fans don't really care (or open wallets).

  • RickRick Posts: 2,731PFN Referee

    Men's football and basketball have BIG money in play so there is a lot of crooked things going on. So yes, if a sport is not crooked State can win at it.

    IMO we have no chance in those two sports. Too much money in keeping status quo.

  • ryebreadryebread Posts: 2,675PFN Referee

    I agree with you with respect to the big $$$. I also agree that we aren't breaking through in football. I do think we could in men's basketball.

  • Vawolf82Vawolf82 Posts: 1,033PFN Referee

    I do think we could in men's basketball.

    That doesn't answer the immediate question. The real question is whether or not KK can break through after the NCAA cloud clears. I'm not sure if talent or coaching is the biggest problem. But by my count, State has only had one big win over the last 2+ seasons (Duke last year). KK had several his first year, but they've been hard to come by since then.

  • ryebreadryebread Posts: 2,675PFN Referee

    Va: I no longer believe that KK can. I do think he’s our coach until the NCAA mess is behind us.

    Basketball is in purgatory...

  • KingHippo_fka_BJD95KingHippo_fka_BJD95 Posts: 4,367PFN Referee

    It's nice to see one of the "marquee" non-rev sports (women's hoopsball) doing so well. Especially since it had seemed like a closed shop (at the very top level) for so long.

  • AdventurooAdventuroo Posts: 3,090

    I would say that maybe we need to figure out WHAT the Women's team has done....but we know the story of Kay Yow hiring Wes and then Debbie recognizing the talent and bringing him back.

    We tried that with Lowe and Whit and Towe...and maybe some others that I don't recall.

    Gannon is a "wit"...can he coach?....he was on a special the other night for the V Foundation.

    I am aghast....he graduated in 1984....was born November 1, 1963....when I was a freshman.... He will be 58 this year. When he turns 60, it is OVER....if we have not "recouped" our MBB's STATUS.....GOD, I feel OLD....

    I often look at Whit and have talked to him at Reynolds with my GK's. They say he looks my age....one of us got a compliment and the other an "UGLY"...

  • choppack1choppack1 Posts: 2,219

    I don’t into the argument that we can’t have a nationally respectable / relevant football program. If you look at the fact that we have fired 3 coaches in the last 25 years and even those coaches were able to beat nationally relevant teams, there’s no reason why a special coach couldn’t elevate us to a Top 30 program. If you look at the players we have put in the NFL - the talent has been here. Clearly, the excellence on the field hasn’t. There’s zero reason with the right coach we can’t become a Wisconsin or a Kansas State. People would have mocked Clemson for thinking they should be a regular contender for a natty 10 years ago.

    Basketball - again, it’s clearly a management issue. If Lee F wouldn’t have been so concerned with “the temperature of the room” - he would have had Beilein. Beilein would have likely had us as a regular and possibly made deep runs in the tournament as he did @ Michigan.

    Hopefully, Keatts is our guy. I am less confident than I was before this year, but a look at other successful conference coaches reveals that the first few years are often bumpy.

    Finally, I see success in the non-revenue much in the way that I saw middle class suburban parents pushing their children into soccer, lacrosse, cross country and competitive swimming. Success was much more likely in these endeavors (and safer) with hard work and some good decision making since the elite athletes pursued basketball and football.

    Success in the myriad of non-revenue sports comes down to competent decision-making and a willingness to throw money down the toilet (because you are highly unlikely to get an ROI.)

  • GsoPackBackerGsoPackBacker Posts: 1,210

    "People would have mocked Clemson for thinking they should be a regular contender for a natty 10 years ago."

    Clemson fans have thought they deserved to be a legit contender since 1981. Not sure about others, but I did mock them. Not because they couldn't be, but just because they expected to be.

    Historically, we're a top 50 football program. I do think top 30 is realistic and maybe in my lifetime even.

    Candidly, I trade all of that for a once in a blue moon championship run.

    A guy can dream

  • ryebreadryebread Posts: 2,675PFN Referee

    I'll take .500 from now to eternity in the ACC in football if we'd get serious about men's basketball and actually attempt to regain our place from the 1970s and 1980s. It'd take far less money to do that than to try to push football up more than about 20th-25th given the football arm's race. If there's any doubt about the level of investment needed in football, just look at the next Taj Mahal that Auburn is building in football.

    Get men's basketball back into relevance and the money will flow in. It can then be spent on football.

    The problem is that we've tried to spread the resources like peanut butter between football and basketball. We are trying to compete at both, but do it poorly. With football we could take everything we have, starve everything else, and still not break into the top 15. The deck is too stacked.

    We could muscle our way in with basketball, but it takes real investment (look at what Tennessee paid Barnes) and institutional testicular fortitude. When I see things like letting this NCAA mess drag out, and KK on rolling contract extensions, I know we're not serious.

  • KingHippo_fka_BJD95KingHippo_fka_BJD95 Posts: 4,367PFN Referee

    Not many schools could pull off the IPTAY thing, let alone do it TWICE.

  • choppack1choppack1 Posts: 2,219

    But basketball doesn’t work that way, at least not in the ACC. Duke and UNC-Ch became giants not because they poured money into it, but rather, they found transformational coaches and hung onto them. Bennett was available to UVa not because they won a bidding wars against the powers of college basketball, but rather because they were willing to take a chance on someone who didn’t play the most aesthetically pleasing form of basketball. FSU stuck with Leonard Hamilton.

    I would also add that NC State has hamstrung itself by playing in a hockey arena. I don’t know if there’s any way out of that. Our best is hope is that Canes begin lobbying for a downtown arena in Raleigh and we can gut a giant portion of it, so it actually is a good basketball arena for all of our games, not just a handful of them.

    But this is why building a program in the 2 college sports that matter (financially) is difficult. Quite frankly, it’s more like building a skyscraper than it is steering a battleship. We are still haunted by running V out, sticking with Les too long, hiring Lee Fowler, not bagging Beilein when he was lined up to go, hiring Lowe and sticking with him too long, then hiring Gott.

    NC State can be good. However, it will take great leadership. Our leaders have to be smarter. We have to be like the Oakland A’s. Unfortunately, we have been like Clippers.

  • phcqmfdphcqmfd Posts: 81

    We have a great Chancellor. We went the good ole boy with our AD. Last good ole boy we hired was Todd turner and he ran off the best baseball coach in ACC in the last 50 years. He won two titles at USC. I would have tried to hire him for the open AD job. We are hoping that Boo will get us a pass for somethings.

  • phcqmfdphcqmfd Posts: 81

    todd turner did get his just deserts by Vandy demoting him and Washington firing him

  • RickRick Posts: 2,731PFN Referee

    Btw right after this thread was started both the wrestling team and women's basketball team lost

  • HighstickHighstick Posts: 418PFN Referee

    I thought you were talking about teams that don't cheat...Certainly can't be talking about the "UNC basketball team that plays football in South Carolina and wears Orange"!

  • phcqmfdphcqmfd Posts: 81

    Dabo brought the cheat like bama to the ACC. Obviously FSU has run out of money in football, which is why they will be changing coaching again here shortly.

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